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Topic: Labels
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See here for the thread that kicked this one off.
Please note this discussion is about people's perceptions of labels and so on - this is not a place to continue the discussion in the above (closed) thread.
A friendly reminder to remain friendly, please! |
:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
I also feel like something to be done to integrate PGPs into the site, like in profiles and next to names.
Adding spots for listing multiple identities and genders might be a nice move too.
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Post: #604984  , Fri 20 Jan 12, 9:56PM |
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:: grum
:: QA Staff (Founder) | |
PGPs? Multiple identities? You've lost me.
Either way, it's worth remembering that it's impossible to define you as a person in drop-down menus.
I wish the world was flat like the old days / And I could travel just by folding the map / No more airplanes or speed trains or freeways / There'd be no distance that could hold us back
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Edit: grum, Fri 20 Jan 12, 10:03PM
Post: #604985 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 10:00PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
Preferred gender pronouns so people know how to respectfully refer to you. Maybe listing them next to names some how?
And for the multiple identities, I mean like being able to list more identities without using override.
Relationship orientation might be another nice thing to do for ace and poly people.
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Post: #604991 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 10:23PM |
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:: grum
:: QA Staff (Founder) | |
I think the "About me" free text box is the best place for this kind of thing.
I wish the world was flat like the old days / And I could travel just by folding the map / No more airplanes or speed trains or freeways / There'd be no distance that could hold us back
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Post: #604995 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 10:32PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
I can see an argument for that on everything except for PGPs, as there is a big effort to include PGPs with names in queer spaces.
For instance I would meet you and say "Hi, I'm Alex and I use feminine or gender neutral pronouns." So that way you wouldn't have to assume my gender identity.
I would also like to point out that with you saying that information like PGPs belong in the "about you" section is that you dont have them listed. So if I was to refer to you with masculine pronouns without asking I could be stomping on a portion of your identity.
Not having everyone list them singles out trans* people and, in a way, makes it seam like there identity is not as legitimate.
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Post: #605003 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 10:57PM |
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I think there are three options that would be good to have in the dropdown boxes, because I see people putting them in the 'prefers' section all the time. For sexuality: Pansexual. For gender: Unsure and Genderqueer. A romantic attraction selection might be a good idea, if it could somehow be put in as optional, so it doesn't have to be there, if your sexual attraction and romantic attraction line up.
I think the ability to add pronouns in a drop down box way, would be simply crazy. I mean, wikipedia has a huge list [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G...neutral_pronoun
] of gender neutral [GN] pronouns that people might use. Also, I prefer a range of pronouons, and my profile would just look messy if I started listing all the GN pronouns up the top, and I wouldn't be the only one. I agree with Grum that the 'About Me' section is the best place to put anything like that.
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Edit: maybeshewill, Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:01PM
Post: #605004 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 10:58PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
@Shane
That's quite cissexist, no ones gender identity has anything to do with what in your pants.
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Post: #605008 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:03PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
Pronouns could probably look just fine in the section with rank bellow your name.
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Post: #605011 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:07PM |
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:: grum
:: QA Staff (Founder) | |
Agreed with Jax. The more drop-down menus we have, and the more personal information we try to capture, the more people get annoyed about what gets included and what gets left out. I have no interest in continually changing and adding new terms to drop-downs.
"Not having everyone list them singles out trans* people"
I strongly disagree. When we meet new people, conversation is all about learning the other person, their preferences, what makes them tick. People make assumptions all the time and we point them out when they're wrong. You're free to share as much of this information, or as little, as you like in your About Me section.
I wish the world was flat like the old days / And I could travel just by folding the map / No more airplanes or speed trains or freeways / There'd be no distance that could hold us back
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Edit: grum, Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:13PM
Post: #605013 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:10PM |
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Something to add: I've seen people who are particular about their pronouns write it next to their gender. So, for example, it might look like this:
Gender: Androgynous (prefers gender neutral pronouns)
What's wrong with that?
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Post: #605017 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:19PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
Gender is a huge part of peoples identities, it's an excellent learning opportunity, and its most definitely a part of what makes people tick.
The idea of using PGPs when you meet people is a strange idea to everyone,but it works really really nicely, and within the last few years its emerged as the introduction of choice for virtually all queer spaces I am involved in.
I know the whole correcting thing seams like a good idea, but it dosnt work like that.
Having your pronouns assumed correctly is a cis* privilege, but remember you have preferred pronouns too.
This is suppose to be a safe place where people don't have things assumed about them  , there's enough cissexism here as is.
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Post: #605020 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:21PM |
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"This is suppose to be a safe place where people don't have things assumed about them , there's enough cissexism here as is."
Not having a drop-down box for pronouns is not cissexism. Not having a drop down box for gender would be cissexism.
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Post: #605028 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:29PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
Jax,
I was referring to just ignorant things people say on here about trans people, not about drop down menus.
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Post: #605031 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:31PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
Another thing to remember is that not everyone's preferred pronouns are going to correspond with there gender identity.
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Post: #605035 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:35PM |
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If people say deliberately ignorant things about trans* people, report it to the mods immediately. I've done it before, and it has been well received.
However, I believe it's important to remember that in the LGBT community, we trans* people are a minority, meaning, people may unintentionally say ignorant things about us. Does that make them cissexist? I suppose so, but it's not intentional. You have to remember that our world divides us up into male/female groups, and it's hard for people to move away from that. The right thing to do is try to educate, rather than get mad and offended.
EDIT: Most people know I'm pretty good with pronouns.. O.o I never said that people's GI had to match up with their preferred pronouns.
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Edit: maybeshewill, Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:40PM
Post: #605036 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:36PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
I agree with that, but a member someone said something blatantly cissexist and offensive in this thread.
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Post: #605038 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:39PM |
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:: grum
:: QA Staff (Founder) | |
Much of the straight world doesn't really understand LGB issues, and many LGB people don't fully understand T issues. Asking questions has got to be seen as good because you get your opportunity to educate others -- through sentences rather than drop-down menus 
Having said that, if something is transphobic, then of course that's not acceptable and it should be reported to a moderator. We have T members on the staff. All members should note that the staff require their help in all areas; help keep us in the loop.
(Edit: Jax kind of beat me to it there).
Alex-Imani, if you're referring to Shane (?), he himself is T...
I wish the world was flat like the old days / And I could travel just by folding the map / No more airplanes or speed trains or freeways / There'd be no distance that could hold us back
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Edit: grum, Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:44PM
Post: #605039 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:40PM |
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As explained in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzYP3s16W9Q
people may identify many different ways. Trans*guys may still identify as lesbian. Why can't they?
EDIT: Sorry about that Grum, didn't mean to stomp on your posting fingers  .
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Edit: maybeshewill, Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:46PM
Post: #605044 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:45PM |
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:: imani
:: QA7 Taking responsibility | |
Being a part of a minority dosnt dosnt mean you cant be discriminatory toward your own minority.
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Post: #605045 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:46PM |
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:: grum
:: QA Staff (Founder) | |
^ True. But there was no malice intended, it was just another perspective.
I wish the world was flat like the old days / And I could travel just by folding the map / No more airplanes or speed trains or freeways / There'd be no distance that could hold us back
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Post: #605048 , Fri 20 Jan 12, 11:50PM |
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